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Baja Forums -:- AzBaja.com Members -:- Projects and Builds -:- AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade- call it DONE
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AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade- call it DONE
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Lucky7-11
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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-Beam is back on!
Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 07:09 PM
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I got ya...

I didn't realize that with coilovers that the towers took all the weight...

Thanks for the info....


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az350x
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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-Beam is back on!
Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 07:21 PM
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Lucky7-11 wrote:
I got ya...

I didn't realize that with coilovers that the towers took all the weight...

Thanks for the info....

Yep, with no more torsion leaves in the beam (or torsion housing in the case of the rear), your shock setup has to be BEEEEEEFY, since your beam and housing just become mere pivot points for the suspension.


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-Beam is back on!
Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 08:17 PM
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Oh yeah- some people take the preload out of their torsions, leave them in the car, and run coilover shocks. Sort of a "hybrid" setup. That would lessen some of the stresses on your shock mounts.


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-Beam is back on!
Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 08:43 PM
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Even on Labor Day ya can learn som-tin'... Very Happy


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-Beam is back on!
Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 05:41 AM
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Welllll, Scott's been makin' some progress on the car lately, and I've been bad and not posting any pics. But, now my wife is watching "America's Got Talent", so I can justify being on the pooter instead of the alternative, which would be slitting my wrists. Razz

So, the SACO rack mount is fabbed up and installed. I need another one of those gold-plated (apparently, judging from the price!) rubber boots. The steering linkage is the current project, and since now the steering is center-mounted, we chopped up the steering column. I'm getting close to assembling the front spindles, hanging the calipers, and then starting the task of plumbing the brakes. I think I'm going to go ahead and install turning brakes now while the plumbing is being re-done, as it seems to make the most sense. An electric linelock is what I'm planning on buying/installing for a parking brake, since I haven't heard anything good about the mechanical 'parking brakes', I'm going to do something different (even though I already HAVE one of the mechanical Jamar ones).

Here's a couple pics-




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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-Beam is back on!
Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 05:43 AM
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Oh yeah- the plan is to have a hoop cross over the steering rack, with tabs dropping down to reinforce the mount.


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 06:16 AM
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Very Happy ol scottie does some great work huh!! Cool looks good!!


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 01:19 AM
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Wihe pan extension not cut, will you have bump steer?


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 05:24 AM
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planenutz wrote:
Wihe pan extension not cut, will you have bump steer?

I'm afraid I don't understand the question. Confused


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57baja
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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 09:15 AM
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...I think what he is trying to say is that the rack is mounted pretty high to clear the pan. I also noticed it's not angled forward, either. You might cycle through your suspension travel with your wheels on and tie rods, etc. (no shocks or springs) and make sure you don't have bump steer while you're already in it this deep. It's a bit of a concern of mine, too, as I look at it. As the suspension comes upward from full droop, it appears that the tie rods may force your wheels to point inward (pigeon toed). If this happens on one side, like hitting a rock, rut, or bump when you're going fast, it may make for a wild ride to say the least.

Hopefully you take this as constructive criticism. I just want you to make sure it all cycles through properly and safely before you get the whole car together.

Looks like good progress. I like your idea of coming off the cage to strengthen the mount.


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 11:29 AM
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Yeah, what he said. Wink
My fingers and the keys aren't always in sync on the keyboard. Rolling Eyes
I've been looking at other peoples rack & pinion installations cause mine will need to get replaced soon. If yours will work then I will save a bunch of cutting and welding. Looking very slick!

57baja wrote:
...I think what he is trying to say is that the rack is mounted pretty high to clear the pan. I also noticed it's not angled forward, either. You might cycle through your suspension travel with your wheels on and tie rods, etc. (no shocks or springs) and make sure you don't have bump steer while you're already in it this deep. It's a bit of a concern of mine, too, as I look at it. As the suspension comes upward from full droop, it appears that the tie rods may force your wheels to point inward (pigeon toed). If this happens on one side, like hitting a rock, rut, or bump when you're going fast, it may make for a wild ride to say the least.

Hopefully you take this as constructive criticism. I just want you to make sure it all cycles through properly and safely before you get the whole car together.

Looks like good progress. I like your idea of coming off the cage to strengthen the mount.


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az350x
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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 04:28 PM
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I see what you're saying. What you can't see in the pics I posted is that the carrier on the rack (that the tierods attach to) extends wayyyyy down below the body of the rack itself, so the tie rods will actually be much lower than the rack itself. In fact, I'm going to have to dent the tunnel ever-so-slightly right at the curve from top to side, because at full steering deflection, the carrier just barely touches the tunnel/head/whatever you wanna call it.

Does that make sense? Does that change your analysis?

As for 57's point, I'll mention it to Scott- he's the engineer/fabricator/experience guru on this project. I'm getting pretty close to mastering the art of standing around looking stupid while he cuts/welds, etc. How would we be able to spot bumpsteer while cycling the suspension?

Thanks for the feedback.


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 05:30 PM
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You want you tie rods to run a close to horizontal as you can/paralel to the ground.

The longer your Tie rods the less bump steer you will get also you can take into account that VW Trailing arms travel in an ARC along the center line of the car. so the closer you get the inner tie rod to the center of that ARC/Cricle the better you are, for less bump steer (Center of the arc is about in the middel of your front torshion tubes).

"A" arms move up and down in an ARC 90' to the center line of the car as VW trailing arms move in a arc along the center line of the car.

So setting the 2 types of supension is not the same...


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-9/23 UPDATE
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 10:11 PM
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az350x wrote:
I see what you're saying. What you can't see in the pics I posted is that the carrier on the rack (that the tierods attach to) extends wayyyyy down below the body of the rack itself, so the tie rods will actually be much lower than the rack itself. In fact, I'm going to have to dent the tunnel ever-so-slightly right at the curve from top to side, because at full steering deflection, the carrier just barely touches the tunnel/head/whatever you wanna call it.

Does that make sense? Does that change your analysis?

As for 57's point, I'll mention it to Scott- he's the engineer/fabricator/experience guru on this project. I'm getting pretty close to mastering the art of standing around looking stupid while he cuts/welds, etc. How would we be able to spot bumpsteer while cycling the suspension?

Thanks for the feedback.

With the suspension free to move up and down (shocks/torrsion removed) lower the front beam down, measure the distance between the front wheels or two treads any reference point, once you have that measurement jack up the beam measuring if that distance changes and if it is more the a 1/4 it is to much. Move the steering box/R&P unit till you find the sweet spot. Any problems call me, glad to help.


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Post Post subject: Re: AZ350X suspension/brake upgrade-10/26 UPDATE
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 04:12 AM
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So, made a little bit of progress today. Got both spindles on. Right side tie rod is on. I'm still short a left International tie rod end. I figured out yesterday that my "short" shocks that I was planning on using for the front are too long. They're Pro Comps, about 12" travel it appears. Need something with a bit shorter body- I guess I'll be needing a 10" Fox or something like that. Sure hate to spend $200/shock on them though, but that seems to be the going rate. I just missed a set of 2.0 Fox 10" with rezzies on ebay for $125- CRAP! If anyone sees a set of 10" travel shocks for sale, let me know please.

Here's what's left, as far as I can tell.

1) Plumb brakes (may install cutting brakes now while I'm into it all)
2) install calipers and wheels
3) drill/bolt lower beam supports to firewall
4) finish steering linkage/install wheel
5) re-pack CVs and install axles
6) cut off old rear bump stops
7) engineer/install rear upper shock mounts
Cool pull it all apart again for paint/powdercoat

OPTIONAL-
1) Install firewall battery terminals (for air compressors, winches, jump starting easier, etc.)
2) Install my CB radio
3) Install on-board air compressor (already have) and air tank (need) so I can air up/down easier, and to power the TRAIN HORNS I want to install!!!
4) Set up the mount for my GPS. I got a Garmin Etrex Legend from a coworker the other day for $50. Never been used. Only has 8mb of memory (no card slot), but should still be ok to get me by.

5) TAKE THE THING OUT TO THE DESERT AND HAVE SOME FUN!


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